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The Meme Machine unleashed, according to Susan Blackmore.

George george_at_cap at hotmail.com
Fri Oct 4 11:58:06 EST 2002


"Glen M. Sizemore" <gmsizemore2 at yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3d9d9db6$3_5 at news.teranews.com...
> GS: Since I have been burned by my news-server before this, I am
re-posting
> this. Sorry if it appears twice (with slightly different wording - I
didn't
> save the brief comment).
>
> >GS: These ideas are very old. The only thing new is the coining of the
term
> > "meme," and the ridiculous notion that it is useful to say that "memes
> > propagate themselves" rather than that practices are selected because
they
> > contribute to a culture's ability to produce food, housing, and more
> > members, and that cultures do this by arranging contingencies of
> > reinforcement that select behavior at the individual level. So much for
> > "memes." Or, rather, so much for Dawkins' intellectual honesty.
>
> RL: Well, someone clearly has an axe to grind... :P
>
> GS: That's what happens when you're the proponent of a maligned position.
If
> you look at the way evolutionary biologists are treated by creationists or
> intelligent design proponents, you get a taste of the way behaviorism (and
> to some extent, cultural materialism) have been treated. The difference
is,
> the misrepresentation has come, ironically, from the psychological
> creationists - and this includes most of what is called "evolutionary
> psychology."
>
> RL: You appear to have misunderstood memes as practices;[...]
>
> GS: Oh, you mean rather than "ideas?" What a bunch of insipid nonsense.
>
> RL: [...]however, in regard to your earlier post, the original ideas of
> Skinner et al are discussed in Dr. Blackmore's book.
>
> GS: What was said? And, no, I'm not prepared to read the book, unless you
> can show me how it isn't more mentalism. My main problem with "memes,"
> however, is the extent to which its progenitors have ignored those who
have
> been calling for a more widespread appreciation of selection as a causal
> force for the last 50 years.
>
> "Richard Lancashire" <rlancashire at hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:8ad6f59.0210040137.72ad5532 at posting.google.com...
> > "Glen M. Sizemore" <gmsizemore2 at yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:<3d9c4592$1_4 at news.teranews.com>...
> > > These ideas are very old. The only thing new is the coining of the
term
> > > "meme," and the ridiculous notion that it is useful to say that "memes
> > > propagate themselves" rather than that practices are selected because
> they
> > > contribute to a culture's ability to produce food, housing, and more
> > > members, and that cultures do this by arranging contingencies of
> > > reinforcement that select behavior at the individual level. So much
for
> > > "memes." Or, rather, so much for Dawkins' intellectual honesty.
> >
> > Well, someone clearly has an axe to grind... :P
> >
> > You appear to have misunderstood memes as practices; however, in
> > regard to your earlier post, the original ideas of Skinner et al are
> > discussed in Dr. Blackmore's book.
> >
> > Cheers
> > Rich

Ah, the king of old fart republicans, Mr. Glenstone,
how is it hangin dude? I think we need a new
newsgroup called "comp.ai.old-republican-farts".

Hoo Hoo






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