In article <m0r6riQ-0003DcC at deep.rsoft.bc.ca>,
Andre Sobolewski <Andre_Sobolewski at MINDLINK.BC.CA> wrote:
>In article <Cz2AGt.1EB at murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU>,
>mgk at darwin.clas.Virginia.EDU (Mahlon G. Kelly) writes:
>>>> >
>> > >All too often regulatory agencies will shut down a small
>> > >communities water supply when the coliform test was positive
>> > >just because a cow wandered by the water source a few hours
>> > >before the sample was taken.
>> >
>> > Are you insinuating that this is not a good reason to shut down
>> access to
>> > that water? What percentage of cows are likely to carry pathogenic
>> bacteria
>> > (Salmonella, Listeria, E.coli, etc.) vs. the percentage of humans?
>> Also, the
>> > earlier statement (distinction of coliforms from cold vs. warm blooded
>> > animals) is misleading if you are referring to transmissibility of
>> pathogenic
>> > bacteria. There is a well documented history of Salmonellosis in
>> humans
>> > occurring from handling of turtles, snakes, frogs, etc. - one of the
>> reasons
>> > small turtles as "pets" for kids was banned or discouraged.
>> >
>> > >If I can help any further, please feel free to email me.
>> > >------------------------------------------
>> > >Mahlon G. Kelly
>> > >mgk at darwin.clas.virginia.edu>> > >------------------------------------------
>> >
2>> > -regards, Peter
>> > **********************************************************************
>> > * Peter M. Muriana, Ph.D. 317-494-8284 TEL *
>> > * Dept. of Food Science 317-494-7953 FAX *
>> > * Purdue University murianap at foodsci.purdue.edu *
>> > * Smith Hall *
>> > * W. Lafayette, IN 47907-1160 *
>> > **********************************************************************
>>>> I am not saying that a water supply should not be shut down if
>> there is a positive test for coliforms, only that the presence
>> of coliforms does not prove that there are pathogens present.
>> Coliforms only show there is a possibility that human waste has
>> been introduced to the water supply. As a class project, I had
>> my students test ca. 30 rural wells for coliforms. about 1/3
>> tested positive. Nearly all were from dairy farms, but because
>> of the location of the well there was nearly no chance that
>> there had been contamination from human waste.
>>>> As to coliforms from poikilotherms, to my knowledge, although
>> some will transmit disease, I don't believe that any will do it
>> via a water supply, and it won't be from their intestinal
>2> bacteria, anyway.
>> --
>> ------------------------------------------
>> Mahlon G. Kelly
>>mgk at darwin.clas.virginia.edu>> ------------------------------------------
>>This is actually an important public health issue that I know too little
>about. We have had a number of local beaches or lakes closed because of
>high coliform counts, which subsequent investigations indicated might have
>been caused, at least in part, by bird droppings.
>>I would really appreciate if some knowledgeable public health folks reading
>this could comment on the above issue, i.e., are there known water-born
>pathogens that will be transported with coliforms (as detected by standard
>m2icrobiological tests) originating from poikilotherms?
>>[This has been cross-posted in sci.biology]
>>>--
>Sincerely,
>Andre Sobolewski Microbial Technologies
>andre_sobolewski at mindlink.bc.ca Phone & Fax: (604) 222-4632
For what it is worth, small turtles did carry Salmonellas that caused disease
in humans. If the presence of coliforms is an indication of fecal
contamination there is the possibility that Salmonellae might also be present
and that their number is sufficiently high to produce disease. In a study we
did using treated sewage plant sludge we only found Salmonellae present in a
few samples while all had coliforms.
