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sports & baking & frustration!

Mon Dec 30 15:38:34 EST 1996

wahchan wrote....(sorry it's the whole thing)


Hi Robyn,
I find its interesting you play soccer and I assume you are from USA?
In England and Europe as well as South America soccer is very popular sport
and currently all professional soccer are men, there are womens league but
all are part time (playing for fun). I was a bit surprise that you (a female)
was actually playing soccer at High school with the boys but at second thought
I remember the game has not really established well in the US and had only
recently taken a slow start after the recent World Cup and soccer in its
true form is a pretty dirty game as well as physical and of course skill
and tactical. I believe in England boys and girls can play soccer together
in school upto 9 yrs old and after that they get seperated because
girls start to loose out on the physical aspect.
On another note the game of hockey was (and probably still is) considered
a "girl's game" at our school, maybe only becuase the girls was encouraged
to take up that sport while the boys took interest in soccer, however
I was the star player for the boys at hockey and took to up the game very
quickly even though we only played no more than 3 or 4 times a year, the girls
played hockey regularly on twice weekly basis and being their sport they
have a proper school team. Well anyway one summer day we organised a
hockey tournament between the boys "part timers" Vs the girls School Team
and guess what, the boys thrashed the girls 5-0, we were better in all
department of the game, we werent being too physical just that we incorporated
the skill of teamwork acquired from soccer and willingness to pressurised
the opponent, maybe there is story somewhere.
As far as treating women as equals, not all but in my opinion most men can
treat women as equal and yes you would need to do it on our term, some
may criticise me for saying so but how else do you expect to gain equality
without earning it? Men too can be descriminated by women, well that is
another argument.



By the time I was in high school (I graduated in 1990), men's soccer had
DEFINATELY established itself in most colleges, universities, & high schools -
especially in NY/NJ/PA. AYSO & other youth soccer organizations offered co-ed
programs from ages 6/7 up to 21 years old. It wasn't unusual to see co-ed teams
in these settings, but very rare to see a girl playing select team or varsity
men's soccer.  I am sorry that the UK separates out the boys & girls at age 9 -
the physicality of soccer is exactly what makes most female players the highest
skilled & most able tactical players on most co-ed teams, in my experience. Of
the 50 people who played on my teams in high school, 7 of them went to college
on soccer scholarships. I was offered scholarships at three well established
women's soccer progams. Not because I was a brute, not because I was an able
soccer player, but because I had taken the experiences from the field & applied
them to my academics (critical reasoning, diligence, dedication). 4 of the men
who had gone to college on similar scholarships failed out of school because
they were unable to make the teamwork & dedication that they had for/during the
game a part of the rest of their lives. The characteristics that men have on the
playing fields of their childhoods very rarely translate into their interactions
with others once they 'grow up.' 

As far as us having to prove ourselves on 'men's terms' ---
Why should I have to jump through your hoops? Who decided that in order to gain
equality from men, you had to act like one? Who decided that there was value in
bringing home the bacon, but none for preparing it? What bothers me most is when 
a new male student comes into the lab & instead of taking my word for some
stupid proceedural point, he usually spends a week doing it completely wrong (or
tries to reinvent the wheel) just to find out that what I said was correct.
We're talking silly things like attempting to run agarose gels in water instead
of TAE buffer, etc. 99% of the men I know are obstinate and have real problems
working in a cooperative venture with women (much less taking direction from
them!). And these are the same men who expect you to clean their glassware &
think media grows on trees & falls into the petri dishes sterile. I think more
women should demand that men jump through a few of their own hoops & see how
quickly they learn to dislike it. I'm not condoning outright discrimination vs.
men - just making them walk the walk more than has happened in the past. Maybe
tenure should be based in part on how good a lobster bisque or balaclava you can
make for the committee meeting! ;)


Robyn Temple
SUNY HSC at Brooklyn


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